which 4L60E

[california roofer]

So I'm a newbie here. I have a 2002 GMC Sierra SL Ext Cab1500 2WD 4.8L automatic with 205,000 miles on it.

Transmission is making chattering / clunking noises at about 30 mph. It calms down when I shift out of D into N, but obviously slows down. I then shift into 3 to make it home (1 mile away). After asking around I try to drive it in 3 hoping that it would be okay, but after 1/2 mile it does the same as before (even though it's now in 3 not D). So I return home and park it. I asked around again, and some questioned if reverse is okay. So I did a short 10 foot reverse test in front of the house, with no apparent problems.

Some people say that 4L60E’s are used for vans, S-10’s, and cars, while full size trucks (2000 and beyond) have 4L65E’s. How do I know what I have before I remove it?

I am trying to budget, and to decide whether to rebuild mine or get an already rebuilt one. Also what should I consider to upgrade / beef up? I realize that the 4.8L motor will not last forever, and will have to face a decision on it when the time comes as well. The rest of the truck is in decent condition 8 out of 10.

Maintenance at 105,000:
• Spark plugs
• Spark plug wires
• Fuel Filter
• Air filter
• Cabin Filter
• PCV valve
• Water pump with gaskets
• Thermostat with O-ring
• Permatex water pump sealant
• Upper and lower radiator hose
• Serpentine belt
• A/C belt
• Pulleys (A/C, serpentine, idler)
• Coolant flush (old fashioned way; 20 min idle, drain and fill until clear)
• DEX-COOL with 50% de-mineralized water

R & R at 198,000
• Rack and pinion (complete with factory installed seals, O-ring, and bellows)
• Inner and outer tie rod ends
• End links
• Front and rear shocks
• Sway bar bushings
• Thrust alignment
• Power steering fluid refill

Maintenance at 205,000:• Fuel Filter
• PCV valve
• Water pump with gaskets
• Thermostat with O-ring
• Permatex water pump sealant
• Upper and lower radiator hose
• Heater hoses (intake, exhaust, and disconnects)
• Coolant recovery tank with cap
• Serpentine belt
• A/C belt
• Pulleys (A/C, serpentine, idler)
• Coolant flush (old fashioned way; 20 min idle, drain and fill five rounds until clear)
• DEX-COOL with 50% distilled water
• Was about to do the plugs, wires, air filter, and cabin filter, but transmission gave out the very next day; after all of this (OUCH)

As you can tell, I tried to take care of my truck as best as I could, and am hoping to get some good use out of it before it is completely useless. I am probably not going to remove it because I just don’t have the place for it; although I have removed and reinstalled a couple of transmissions before. I have also rebuilt an 82 S-10 2.8 V-6 engine; completely (broken crank, and #1 piston rod). I think I am mechanically inclined and a decent DIY mechanic (not shade tree).

What should I expect to pay for a standard rebuild plus any hard parts?
What should I expect to pay for an upgrade / beefed up rebuild plus hard parts?
What should I expect to pay for an already rebuilt one and just core mine?

 

[Z15]

Some people say that 4L60E’s are used for vans, S-10’s, and cars, while full size trucks (2000 and beyond) have 4L65E’s. How do I know what I have before I remove it?

4L60E was the standard trans behind a 4.8 and 5.3L engine.

The 4L65E was used behind the 6.0L in 1500 trucks such as the Denali, Esccalade etc and not behind anything smaller. Its just a beefed up version of the 4L60E to handle the HP the 6.0L and all wheel drive these other trucks came with. In car is was behind performance engines.

Inside the glove box is a list of regular production option codes on your truck. Transmission are code beginning with M

Find the M codes


M30 Transmission – 4 Speed Auto W/ Electric Controls L.D. (Hydra-Matic 4L60-E)
M32 Transmission – 4-Speed Auto W/Electric Controls L.D. (Hydra-Matic 4L60-E)

MN8 Code for 4L65E

As for pricing, it can be all over the map from $3,000 down. Don't let price be the determining factor as the lower the price, the more often the lower the quality of work and components. Of course that does not mean higher price means better quality.
http://www.transdepot.net/4L60E_c_22.html

 

[california roofer]

Thanks for the glove box info; appreciate it very much. My glove box has the M30, so I take it that mine is a 4L60E. I am considering rebuilding mine (if feasible) including any broken hard parts. What other parts are known to be problematic for the 4L60E?
I hear a lot about:
• Beast Sunshells
• Bands
• Sprags
• Planetary gears
• Solenoids
• Bearings
Which of these should I also replace for a thorough rebuild (not just a clutches, gasket/seals, and filter kit) if I do end up rebuilding mine? I believe in doing things right, and don’t want to R & R the transmission for a while. I plan on having the torque converter rebuilt as well. Please list any other parts I may have missed.

 

[Z15]

It would easier and faster to buy a quality remanufacturered trans that carries a good warranty. The GM ones are pricey but carry a good warranty when installed by an authorized installer, a GM dealer or AC Delco dealer for example and they have a excellent reputation for quality.

As for what parts to replace, I have no idea. Remans are just a better alternative IMO. You are getting rid of your transmission and not risking a cheap rebuild that would come back to haunt you later.

 

[california roofer]

Sorry for the double post. I am unsure if the first one went through or not.

Okay, so I am entertaining (I SAID ENTERTAINING) on rebuilding mine instead of getting a “SO-CALLED-REBUILT” transmission by some cheap Craigslister (sorry but the GM tranys are out of my range, so is a performance built one).

Here are a few links to a thorough rebuild kit. I am questioning the quality and reliability of some of these products. I am not a pro and am looking for some input from you guys on the brands and models of some of these products. I know it is a pain to read all of the details in the ads to retrieve all the parts included, but I figured you guys may already be familiar with these kits.

The Corvette Servo may or may not be included in the TruTech Level 2 Master Kit. It is not pictured or in the bullet points, but it comes up in the paragraph below. That’s why I included it as a separate buy just in case. I will make a call to trutech and get confirmation before I spend away.

Should I get this shift kit? Does this include all the valves or just an upgrade for certain ones? Does a shift kit force me to manually shift gears all the time, or is it an option when I want to race it? (Sorry to sound like a green-horn, but I never had a shift kit)

Please fire away. I am in the preliminary stages still.

Total expenses; 714.48 + 152.90 + 87.90 + 16.75 + 40.30 = $1012.33 plus synthetic fluid, exhaust gaskets, and RTV Ultra Black (another $150 from my local autozone)

$669.99 + $44.49 = $714.48 Shipping Enterprise Alabama (4-11 days) http://www.trutechtrans.com 800-762-9846 10-4 CST Mon-Sat
http://www.ebay.com/itm/TRUTECH-LEV...pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr


$139.95 + $12.95 = $152.90 Monmouth Oregon (5 days) http://www.electricaladvantage.net (614) 364-0698
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Master-Sole...pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr

$87.90 Free Shipping Tallmadge Ohio (4-6 days) http://www.summitracing.com 800-230-3030 open 24/7
http://www.ebay.com/itm/TransGo-Shi...pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr

$16.75 Free Shipping Monmouth Oregon (5 days) http://www.electricaladvantage.net (614) 364-0698
http://www.ebay.com/itm/UPGRADE-SER...Parts_Accessories&hash=item35b4425ba9&vxp=mtr



$35.00 + $5.30 = $40.30 Kankakee Illinois (6-7 Days) Shift Rite Transmissions 815-935-2356 M-F 8-5 CST
http://www.ebay.com/itm/GM-Chevy-4L60E-Pump-Rebuild-Kit-COMPLETE-Seal-Bushing-/250832504054

 

[california roofer]

Sorry for the multiple post (if any). I am unsure if the first others went through or not.

Okay, so I am entertaining (I SAID ENTERTAINING) on rebuilding mine instead of getting a “SO-CALLED-REBUILT” transmission by some cheap Craigslister (sorry but the GM transmissions are out of my price range right now, and so is a performance built one).

Here are a few kits and/or separate parts I have picked out off of eBay. I am questioning the quality and reliability of some of these products. I am not a pro and am looking for some input from you guys on the brands and models of some of these products. It’s hard to get the better parts from different manufacturers in a kit. So I am compromising a little or too much? I am hoping you guys can help me make an educated decision.

The pump rebuild-parts, and Corvette Servo may or may not be included in the TruTech Level 2 Master Kit. They are not pictured or in the bullet points, but they come up in the miscellaneous description. That’s why I included them as a separate buys just in case. I will make a call to trutech and get confirmation before I spend away.

Trutech, Performance Transmission, Master Builder Level 2 Complete Build Kit, High Performance, 1997-2003 4L60/65E, Street / Strip up to 550 HP, Included are:
• Complete Raybestos Stage One Friction Kit
• Complete set steels with 3-4 Kolene steels
• Complete gasket and seal kit
• Wide Raybestos Pro Series Band
• ACDelco 3-4 Apply and Backing plates for proper 3-4 clearance
• New ACDelco reverse input drum
• "Beast" sun shell
• ACDelco 5 pinion rear planetary gear
• Trutech Performance Shift Improvement Module
• Raybestos heavy duty 29 element forward sprag
• Complete bushing kit with Teflon front pump bushing
• Complete thrust washer kit
• ACDelco 3rd accumulator and 3-4 exhaust check valves for hydraulic integrity
• 3 input drum bonded steel clutch pistons
• Sonnax replacement load release springs
• Quality OEM filter

Electrical Advantage, Master Solenoid Kit W/Harness 4L60E 95 to 02 pwm

Electrical Advantage, UPGRADE SERVO KIT 700R4 4L60E CORVETTE 2ND & 4TH PISTON

TransGo, Shift Kit Automatic Type Includes .500" Boost Valve GM 4L60E

Should I get this shift kit? Does this include all the valves or just an upgrade for certain ones? Does a shift kit force me to manually shift gears all the time, or is it an option when I want to race it? (Sorry to sound like a green-horn, but I never had a shift kit)

Shift Rite Transmissions, GM Chevy 4L60E Pump Rebuild Kit COMPLETE Seal Bushing

Please fire away. I am in the preliminary stages still.

Total expenses; $1012.33 plus synthetic fluid, exhaust gaskets, RTV Ultra Black, Brake Cleaner, etc… (Another $150 from my local AutoZone)

 

[cwilson]

Don't forget about the special tools to install the pistons with lip seals and to size the turbine shaft seals. these tools can be expensive.

 

[california roofer]

Before I get into the tools...

I want to know about the following items which come in the TruTech Level 2 Master Kit:

• Complete Raybestos Stage One Friction Kit
How does it compare to other models and/or brands such as: Z-Pack, Alto Red Eagle, etc?

• Complete set steels with 3-4 Kolene steels
How do these compare to other brands or treatments/coatings?

• Wide Raybestos Pro Series Band
How does this compare to other brands or designs? Some brands offer thicker and/or wider.

• ACDelco 3-4 Apply and Backing plates for proper 3-4 clearance
Should I consider other brands?

• New ACDelco reverse input drum
Should I consider other brands?

• ACDelco 5 pinion rear planetary gear
Should I consider other brands? Should I keep the 4 pinion (I heard someone say the 5 pinion has its own weaknesses/problems).

• Trutech Performance Shift Improvement Module
What is this, and is it a decent product?

• Raybestos heavy duty 29 element forward sprag
Should I consider a 30 element sprag if this is a performance kit after all?

• ACDelco 3rd accumulator and 3-4 exhaust check valves for hydraulic integrity
I heard that some people block off the accumulators.

• Sonnax replacement load release springs
How do these compare to stock or other brands?


I hear people say to stay away from TransGo, but would like an educated reason as to why stay away from TransGo, and why go with another brand? Are others thicker, better material, last longer, better designed, etc…

Personally Raybestos makes me feel like I am getting a “Pep Boys special” (I may be wrong). Since I am considering doing a thorough rebuild, I don’t want to R & R the transmission any time soon.

I also want to know about the TransGo shift kit as well.

• TransGo, Shift Kit Automatic Type Includes .500" Boost Valve
Are there other better brands out there?

There is a TransStar1 near me, but their website doesn’t have prices. You have to call in and they have salesmen quote you individually. I have a feeling that they will rip me off. That’s why I am considering ordering online.

 

[california roofer]

yeah, the tools, ugh... Oh well I'll have even more tools

Anyone have any reviews/comments regarding the above mentioned parts, brands, and models?

Would like to make an educated decision.

Thanks

 

[Z15]

If you are going to attempt to rebuild your 1st automatic transmission to save a few $$, you are crazy. Its like doing brain surgery on yourself. There are car dealers that farm these jobs out to professional trans shops because rebuilding auto trans is a skill typically not acquired thru trial and error. If you want to save som $$, go buy a used one from a salvage yard, they often come with a warranty just as good as what a local rebuilder would give you. Some salvage yards even do installation.

 

[california roofer]

I am more affraid of getting ripped off rather than penny pinching. I do my own oil changes because I don't trust others. Call me schizo, but I've been fooled by warranties, certified pro's, etc... When I build it I know whats in it.

A typical transmission rebuilder will do a "Kit-Rebuild" and replace the broken hard part. A typical warrantied transmission is rebuilt with stock parts. What about the rest of the parts, which may seem fine for now, but may break just months after it is installed?

You're right! I want to learn. At the same time, I would like to build a stronger transmission. But then again; I may end up just letting the truck fall apart, who knows?

 

[Z15]

for your reference